My 2 (tiny) cents;
As always you start a great discussion and I applaud you for that!

The comments made in this thread are IMO a good impression of all the benefits and downfall’s of the MVP Program.

I myself like the program very much because it now awards more people who are helpful by nature. The fact you want to spend time helping someone you don’t know makes you a winner in my book. (not to mention how beneficial it is too yourself…)

I like the idea of a professional Excel Dev association too, and while where there I’d like to see one for Word as well! (Which is more my playing field)

The presence of MS in the person of Sean is truly great and I’m glad to see MS is taking great interest in participating here.

Thanks and keep it up Dennis!

Groetjes,
Joost Verdaasdonk

http://www.officearticles.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=14

You are not required to register to that forum, but it requires a password, which is LetMeIn

I have attempted to start some discussions and hope that you will help. I am NOT a Professional Excel Developer (at least not by my own definition), but can certainly get us up and running, be the webmaster, host it free, etc. Making comments in that forum does not commit you to anything, but your input as would-be members is critical.

Dennis: Thank you for this discussion.

~Anne Troy

I have gained enormous benefit from the NG’s. I do not care one jot whether the respondent is an MVP or not. One quickly learns where the real intellect lies, and there are many posts that I read, not because of the topic, but because I know that that particular respondent will have an interesting perspective on the problem, and one that I might learn from. I will not embarrass anyone by listing names, but I am sure that a poll of all regular readers would lead to list which is would not be dis-similar from “my favourites”.

Do I expect the people who have been given the MVP accolade to know “everything” about Excel? No I don’t. Do I expect them to be “pushing the bounds of Excel”? No I don’t. I respect the knowledge they do have, and their willingness to share it with others. Yes there are many people out there who have as much, or maybe more, knowledge about Excel than some of the MVP’s. Does this matter? No. Does it detract from the status of the MVP? No.

At the end of the day, Microsoft have developed software packages which are used by millions of people to assist them in diverse ways from fantasy football leagues to effective monitoring and control of large business operations. The everyday users have problems to be solved, and need a helping hand from time to time. The NG questions and responses resolve their queries in practically all cases. At the time, a solution which works is what is needed and appreciated. Whether it is the most efficient method is probably not at the top of the priority list for most posters. For those where it is, then they will go on (when time is less pressing compared with their immediate need) to read up more and seek more efficient or easier ways of resolving their application needs, and along the way will enhance their overall knowledge of the program it’s abilities, it’s limitations and (at times) it’s sheer frustrations.

So why are there MVP’s? I do not think that they should be developing Excel. Microsoft pay large numbers of programmers to carry out that task. Microsoft needs to know what people want and I would see Microsoft requiring conduits to people’s requirements out in the big wide world. So, why not reward people who they believe have served the community at large very well, and who they can use as a conduit to gain views for future direction and development? Not everyone can be chosen to fulfil such a role, that’s the way of the world, so there will be many who may feel peeved at being overlooked.

Now whether Microsoft use this valuable resource of the MVP programme effectively is another issue. There have been suggestions earlier in the thread, that Sean O’Driscoll and his team have not listened to the views of the MVP’s – but I think that was in terms of appointments to the MVP programme, rather than other matters.

Well, that’s my “two penn’oth” (2 cents for the non UK readers) and it is against this background that I have made my own contributions into the NG’s. I have learnt a lot, I would like to give something back. On slacker days, I might post a lot, especially if a quick fix can be suggested, on other days not all. I usually do scan most of the posts though, and even when busy, I find it quite relaxing to go look at a few problems and wrestle with them, even if I don’t post a solution because somebody else has, or has posted something far better. I find it quite therapeutic at times so a very big thank you to all contributors, (MVP’s or not), you’re thoughts (and “company”) have certainly enriched my life.

Many others seem to view this entire discussion as “you old timers are just whining about new members in the country club.” While nothing could be further from the truth, it is difficult if not impossible to refute such accusations without possibly inciting a flame war. So, as others have done, it would appear prudent to just roll with those punches.

Let me add some more thoughts to what has been said here.

When I was awarded, I felt I’d never compare to the MVP’s already in there. All of a sudden I was amongst the handful of worldclass Excel experts. And I myself sure didn’t consider myself being that. And I knew I would never measure up with a couple of them, or even with most of them.

But it sure boosted my activities in the Excel area. And I learnt very much in the process too. I can even say it gave me the last nudge I needed to start my own business as an Excel/Office consultant and developer.

That being said, what is my standpoint in this discussion?

I will not judge any new MVP. I am not in the position to do so, nor do I want to be in that position. I wholeheartedly congratulate anyone getting this fantastic reward!! (including me ))

I am pleased MS asks our opinion when it comes to new MVP’s. But I would appreciate some sort of feedback as to why person A has been accredited or not. Currently, we receive no feedback (not in my perception, maybe I missed a couple?).

I am glad this thread has turned into a fruitful discussion. I was afraid it wouldn’t and I am convinced the presence of Sean has helped tremendously to turn this into the good exchange of thoughts and opinions it has become now. Thanks for your openness Sean, much appreciated.

Let me finish off by saying that I hope this (at first glance) very negatively coloured blog post (the root cause of this discussion) will help improve the MVP program.

That took a while to read but I was glad I did.
I grew up on Lotus 1-2-3, VpPlanner. Quattro and Excel.
My heroes were Chip Pearson and John Walkenbach in the late nineties and 2000′s for their excellent books and resoruces.
Like many others here I am considered an excel guru within my consulting business clients and I promote myself as one to them.
However I have always said that compared to people like J-Walk I know 1% of the Excel he knows.
I originally created my website and the mailing list I have for my clients to assist them, and as such a lot of the content is fairly non technical, and is based around how to do stuff that most proficient Excel users can do with their eyes shut.
I never anticipated MVP or nomination for it (haven’t received it either!) and in fact didn’t even know what it was when I did start the website.
Of recent times I have been extremely honoured to be linked on sites like this one, J-walk, Andy Popes and more.
I have made some small contributions to the JMT forums but largely have no access to forums on a timely basis to contribute. As mentioned above the answer has usually already been supplied.

I read with great interest Sean’s posts and see quite a gap between his explanation of the MVP program and what some posters in this discussion have determined it should be.
|quote|
As a Microsoft employee, I’m very happy there are Excel experts with a knowledge level of 10 in the industry. But if they are a 10 in the industry but only a 2 in contribution to community, then the MVP program is not for them. If you are a 5 in technical leadership, but a 10 in community…then I think the MVP program needs to pay attention.
|end quote|

If I may add my two cents I think that the MVP program should remain firmly where it is (as defined by Sean) and that a separate peer nominated program for Guru status (technical competence) be created. It should be separate to Microsoft and probably be a professional organisation. It whould not be based on fee for service but be nominated by users clients or by yourself and then judged on a number of tecnhical merits.
As in any undertaking like this there would be numerous pitfalls to overcome in the first rounds of creation and ongoing tweaks to be made, but this could be recognised and dealt with by 5 yearly reviews of the system.
The concept of fellows within this organisation should definitely be promoted.
My pick for lifetime members is obiously biased by my reality but would definitely include John Walkenbach, Chip Pearson.
Founding members would include Dick, Jon, Steve, Andy, Colo and more (not trying to leave anybody out).
Professional membership fees would be charged to cover the admin costs of such a professional body.

I think that the ideas here and the allusions by others to the concept of a professional body should be promoted on another website or at least in another thread.
I have created a link to this thread and posted this comment on my website.
http://www.spyjournal.biz/exceltips/2006/02/excel-mvp-and-professional-guru.html

“I’m not up to the technical standard of ______”

Ha, that’s a common thought among newly-minted MVPs. In fact, there’s been some joking in the past about needing new MVPs to handle all the Tools-Options questions, so the old MVPs can concentrate on the more interesting and challenging questions.

I think we all get too much unsolicited email looking for help. I help some of them, but many I refer to the newsgroups. Then ironically enough, I may be the one to answer their post. It’s easier to justify the effort if it’s public. Sometimes I answer their private email, then turn it into a new web page, which also helps justify the effort.

I was looking at your site a little while ago. Quite an impressive list of books (so I guess you could handle the Tools-Options chores for a while, eh?). One way you might volunteer content in your site is to post a sample chapter of each book. Other authors have done this. A chapter would be all that some people want to see, but it might encourage others to buy the whole book. Also, it claims that you’re a professional comedian: post a few jokes, but I’ll bet Bob Umlas knows more!

My own web site is loaded with free content, a hobby that turned into an obsession when my previous day job became unbearable. My ulterior motive now is that this showcases my capabilities and interests, helps a lot of people, and brings in work. My sig line in the forums brings people to my web site, answering more questions, and bringing in even more work.

Dick -

“To avoid being punched in the nose at the next MVP summit…”

You won’t be there??