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	<title>Comments on: Excel and Business</title>
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	<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/</link>
	<description>Daily posts of Excel tips…and other stuff</description>
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		<title>By: Chay Harley</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-18934</link>
		<dc:creator>Chay Harley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 21 Feb 2006 05:41:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-18934</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&quot;...just don&#039;t know any VPs of Finance that use Excel at any advanced level.&quot;  &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I got made VP because of my ability to utilise Excel in the securities industry. I&#039;m able to take raw database data from our trading systems and pop it into Excel giving breakdowns on clients, how much they spend with us and our profit levels per client.&lt;br&gt;
Furthermore, the advanced level of VBA that I do also allows automation of many tasks that the traders perform, giving them more time to watch the market... &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I would estimate that I&#039;ve easily given back around 1-2 hours each day to each trader. Ongoing efforts will ensure more time is available for new financial initatives (which of course will require automation later, ensuring that not only have I got more work, but that the company has a higher monetary return rate per trader as time passes by).&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Don&#039;t sell it short...&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;&#8230;just don&#8217;t know any VPs of Finance that use Excel at any advanced level.&#8221;  </p>
<p>I got made VP because of my ability to utilise Excel in the securities industry. I&#8217;m able to take raw database data from our trading systems and pop it into Excel giving breakdowns on clients, how much they spend with us and our profit levels per client.<br />
Furthermore, the advanced level of VBA that I do also allows automation of many tasks that the traders perform, giving them more time to watch the market&#8230; </p>
<p>I would estimate that I&#8217;ve easily given back around 1-2 hours each day to each trader. Ongoing efforts will ensure more time is available for new financial initatives (which of course will require automation later, ensuring that not only have I got more work, but that the company has a higher monetary return rate per trader as time passes by).</p>
<p>Don&#8217;t sell it short&#8230;</p>
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		<title>By: fzz</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-17711</link>
		<dc:creator>fzz</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Dec 2005 07:02:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-17711</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Was knowing how to use an IBM Selectric typewrite a necessary skill back 25 years ago, or was it sufficient to know how to type?&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I&#039;m Darwinian. Universities shouldn&#039;t provide their students any spreadsheets training, but when appropriate some classes should require spreadsheet modeling. Those that can learn on their own won&#039;t have a problem. Those that can&#039;t would be in for a huge shock once they enter the real world and have to work with other systems for which they weren&#039;t trained in school, e.g., most if not all legacy mainframe and mini applications.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Spreadsheets have become poor tools. Back in the 1980s they were better than most of the alternatives. Formulas could calculate with numbers and manipulate text, and the underlying grid allowed easy creation of simple interfaces. MUCH, MUCH easier than dBase or BASICA programming. That isn&#039;t the case today. There are visual interface development tools that are much better than what spreadsheets provide, and given a library of spreadsheet-like functions, most if not all programming languages would provide better control and easier verification and maintenance.&lt;/p&gt;
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Was knowing how to use an IBM Selectric typewrite a necessary skill back 25 years ago, or was it sufficient to know how to type?</p>
<p>I&#8217;m Darwinian. Universities shouldn&#8217;t provide their students any spreadsheets training, but when appropriate some classes should require spreadsheet modeling. Those that can learn on their own won&#8217;t have a problem. Those that can&#8217;t would be in for a huge shock once they enter the real world and have to work with other systems for which they weren&#8217;t trained in school, e.g., most if not all legacy mainframe and mini applications.</p>
<p>Spreadsheets have become poor tools. Back in the 1980s they were better than most of the alternatives. Formulas could calculate with numbers and manipulate text, and the underlying grid allowed easy creation of simple interfaces. MUCH, MUCH easier than dBase or BASICA programming. That isn&#8217;t the case today. There are visual interface development tools that are much better than what spreadsheets provide, and given a library of spreadsheet-like functions, most if not all programming languages would provide better control and easier verification and maintenance.</p>
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		<title>By: jjames</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-17709</link>
		<dc:creator>jjames</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 11 Dec 2005 01:19:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-17709</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Excel is not necessary for advancement in Finance/Accounting. I have worked many years in the field and all my bosses have had only a rudimentary knowledge of Excel and none of VBA.  During my time, very few if any &quot;geeks&quot; got to be boss.  I consider myself a geek and somehow got up to CFO at several orginazations.  Excel/Access/VBA helped me do my job, but honestly, knowing Excel wasn&#039;t a factor in my advancement.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Excel is not necessary for advancement in Finance/Accounting. I have worked many years in the field and all my bosses have had only a rudimentary knowledge of Excel and none of VBA.  During my time, very few if any &#8220;geeks&#8221; got to be boss.  I consider myself a geek and somehow got up to CFO at several orginazations.  Excel/Access/VBA helped me do my job, but honestly, knowing Excel wasn&#8217;t a factor in my advancement.</p>
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		<title>By: Jon Peltier</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-17700</link>
		<dc:creator>Jon Peltier</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Dec 2005 14:13:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-17700</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Dennis and Rembo have been following the argument that Excel and other software applications are tools. This is a very good thing to keep in mind.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Since I was in college, I&#039;ve been using computers as tools. We used these tools for data acquisition from the laboratory tests we were running, and to help us analyze and understand these results. My objective was not to write a program, it was to figure out what the data was telling me, and sometimes writing a program was a great way to do this.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Later, as a researcher in the corporate world (which has become an oxymoron), I continued with computers and software as tools. In addition to data acq and analysis, I learned to use computers to automate mundane tasks. I learned to use Solver in analyzing and predicting materials behavior under cyclic loading. I had to run Solver to analyze the loading cycle, then the unloading cycle, then repeat the halves of the cycle until the Solver solutions converged. My first nontrivial VBA procedure was a tool to automate this cyclic Solver analysis. It took over a week to get it to work, but in the end, the manual Solver process, which took 1-2 days for a page of different cases, was reduced to a VBA procedure that took under 5 minutes. I have yet to duplicate that productivity gain.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Now as a developer, I keep the attitude that Excel, and my programs developed in Excel, are just the tools that a client may use to accomplish a task. It keeps me honest, so although we all know Excel is a flexible and powerful tool, I don&#039;t forget that it&#039;s not always the right one for the job. I also realize that this is how most clients view the programs I produce, and knowing that my programs are tools helps me to design better tools.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dennis and Rembo have been following the argument that Excel and other software applications are tools. This is a very good thing to keep in mind.</p>
<p>Since I was in college, I&#8217;ve been using computers as tools. We used these tools for data acquisition from the laboratory tests we were running, and to help us analyze and understand these results. My objective was not to write a program, it was to figure out what the data was telling me, and sometimes writing a program was a great way to do this.</p>
<p>Later, as a researcher in the corporate world (which has become an oxymoron), I continued with computers and software as tools. In addition to data acq and analysis, I learned to use computers to automate mundane tasks. I learned to use Solver in analyzing and predicting materials behavior under cyclic loading. I had to run Solver to analyze the loading cycle, then the unloading cycle, then repeat the halves of the cycle until the Solver solutions converged. My first nontrivial VBA procedure was a tool to automate this cyclic Solver analysis. It took over a week to get it to work, but in the end, the manual Solver process, which took 1-2 days for a page of different cases, was reduced to a VBA procedure that took under 5 minutes. I have yet to duplicate that productivity gain.</p>
<p>Now as a developer, I keep the attitude that Excel, and my programs developed in Excel, are just the tools that a client may use to accomplish a task. It keeps me honest, so although we all know Excel is a flexible and powerful tool, I don&#8217;t forget that it&#8217;s not always the right one for the job. I also realize that this is how most clients view the programs I produce, and knowing that my programs are tools helps me to design better tools.</p>
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		<title>By: Rembo</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-17699</link>
		<dc:creator>Rembo</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Dec 2005 13:40:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-17699</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Dick,&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I agree with you for the most part. Dennis makes a good statement though when he says that Excel is just a tool. There are other tools available and educating Excel at university is ok as long as people are also tought that there are other tools available and that they shouldn&#039;t limit theirselves to just one solution. In spreadsheet land there are numerous other players and I reckon that some of those are more suitable for certain jobs then Excel. To get the best solution you have to be open minded to all options. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;You, me and most other people reading this have trained themselves to use Excel, exploring options and possibilities, trying to get as much out of it as we can. But, ironically, in doing so some folks also narrow their view and tend to use Excel as a wonder-cure for most problems. How many examples do you know of people using Excel as a semi-database whilst a (real) relational database would have been a better choice?&lt;br&gt;
Note that at this stage one doesn&#039;t need detailed knowledge of databases yet, just knowing the key differences between spreadsheets and databases would have been enough to make an other decision.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I think we should look at that process as a more general way of solving problems. Don&#039;t learn people to stick with just one &#039;solution&#039; but make them aware of the fact that there are multiple tools to choose from, sometimes even different methods. That&#039;s what they should teach at university. Of course, students ahve to practice and Excel isn&#039;t a bad choice given the fact that they are likely to run into it in real life. But solving real life problems are details, and are found downward in the tree of decision making when it comes to solving problems. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;One more thing: I totally agree with you that placing it on your resume isn&#039;t really going to help you getting a job. However, once you got the job and get the chance to &#039;show off&#039; with what you can do with Excel it will certainly help you in keeping the job and even moving up.&lt;br&gt;
As they say here; in the land of the blind one eye is king ;-)&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dick,</p>
<p>I agree with you for the most part. Dennis makes a good statement though when he says that Excel is just a tool. There are other tools available and educating Excel at university is ok as long as people are also tought that there are other tools available and that they shouldn&#8217;t limit theirselves to just one solution. In spreadsheet land there are numerous other players and I reckon that some of those are more suitable for certain jobs then Excel. To get the best solution you have to be open minded to all options. </p>
<p>You, me and most other people reading this have trained themselves to use Excel, exploring options and possibilities, trying to get as much out of it as we can. But, ironically, in doing so some folks also narrow their view and tend to use Excel as a wonder-cure for most problems. How many examples do you know of people using Excel as a semi-database whilst a (real) relational database would have been a better choice?<br />
Note that at this stage one doesn&#8217;t need detailed knowledge of databases yet, just knowing the key differences between spreadsheets and databases would have been enough to make an other decision.</p>
<p>I think we should look at that process as a more general way of solving problems. Don&#8217;t learn people to stick with just one &#8216;solution&#8217; but make them aware of the fact that there are multiple tools to choose from, sometimes even different methods. That&#8217;s what they should teach at university. Of course, students ahve to practice and Excel isn&#8217;t a bad choice given the fact that they are likely to run into it in real life. But solving real life problems are details, and are found downward in the tree of decision making when it comes to solving problems. </p>
<p>One more thing: I totally agree with you that placing it on your resume isn&#8217;t really going to help you getting a job. However, once you got the job and get the chance to &#8216;show off&#8217; with what you can do with Excel it will certainly help you in keeping the job and even moving up.<br />
As they say here; in the land of the blind one eye is king <img src='http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';-)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: Byron - construction management NJ</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-17696</link>
		<dc:creator>Byron - construction management NJ</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 09 Dec 2005 12:26:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-17696</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Nearly evey post mentions it but are we not seeing it?  Excel is a tool! A wonderful, versatile tool but still just a tool.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;A pencil, a hammer, a shovel, a truck and a gun are also tools!  They all are devices that aid us in performing a task.  They allow us to do something better, faster or in a larger quantity than we could without the tool.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Training in the basic concepts is most important.  Once that is understood the need to master Excel will be obvoius.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;To focus on the how and not the why dooms people to dead-end career paths.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Nearly evey post mentions it but are we not seeing it?  Excel is a tool! A wonderful, versatile tool but still just a tool.</p>
<p>A pencil, a hammer, a shovel, a truck and a gun are also tools!  They all are devices that aid us in performing a task.  They allow us to do something better, faster or in a larger quantity than we could without the tool.</p>
<p>Training in the basic concepts is most important.  Once that is understood the need to master Excel will be obvoius.</p>
<p>To focus on the how and not the why dooms people to dead-end career paths.</p>
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		<title>By: C.G. Ouimet</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-17662</link>
		<dc:creator>C.G. Ouimet</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Dec 2005 18:10:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-17662</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;&quot;The target with tools like Excel et al in higher education is not to get well trained students in how the tools works. The target is to create relevant information for decision making and simulations of business interest, i e the focus is on decision making and not the tool itself.&quot;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I agree but there are many people using Excel with skills to use the tools insufficient to generate the right information in the right way so that the right decisions are made.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I have inherited many spreadsheets that were badly designed, flawed and full of bugs. How good were the decisions made with that information.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;In many ways, Excel is a dangerous tool in the wrong hands. Proper training is critical.&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The target with tools like Excel et al in higher education is not to get well trained students in how the tools works. The target is to create relevant information for decision making and simulations of business interest, i e the focus is on decision making and not the tool itself.&#8221;</p>
<p>I agree but there are many people using Excel with skills to use the tools insufficient to generate the right information in the right way so that the right decisions are made.</p>
<p>I have inherited many spreadsheets that were badly designed, flawed and full of bugs. How good were the decisions made with that information.</p>
<p>In many ways, Excel is a dangerous tool in the wrong hands. Proper training is critical.</p>
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		<title>By: Hui</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-17659</link>
		<dc:creator>Hui</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Dec 2005 15:55:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-17659</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Microsoft are looking for a Project Manager to steer the next version of Excel...&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;&lt;a href=&quot;http://blogs.msdn.com/excel/default.aspx&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;http://blogs.msdn.com/excel/default.aspx&lt;/a&gt;&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;So here&#039;s your chance to get those wish lists completed!&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Microsoft are looking for a Project Manager to steer the next version of Excel&#8230;</p>
<p><a href="http://blogs.msdn.com/excel/default.aspx" rel="nofollow">http://blogs.msdn.com/excel/default.aspx</a></p>
<p>So here&#8217;s your chance to get those wish lists completed!</p>
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		<title>By: KBurns</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-17658</link>
		<dc:creator>KBurns</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Dec 2005 15:02:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-17658</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;I agree with your comments.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Everyone now seems to &quot;know&quot; Excel. What they know is minimal. Most haven&#039;t taken a formal course to really learn Excel. What I have learned over the years comes out of a strong interest to be able to use it as a true helpful tool. I used to think that everyone should learn it but have come to the conclusion that I will develop a program so they can use that. I password protect it and then hope they don&#039;t goof it up.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The best sources for learning Excel has been J-Walk books and website, then your blog! Always glad to see your posts.  - an Architect, Tacoma&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with your comments.</p>
<p>Everyone now seems to &#8220;know&#8221; Excel. What they know is minimal. Most haven&#8217;t taken a formal course to really learn Excel. What I have learned over the years comes out of a strong interest to be able to use it as a true helpful tool. I used to think that everyone should learn it but have come to the conclusion that I will develop a program so they can use that. I password protect it and then hope they don&#8217;t goof it up.</p>
<p>The best sources for learning Excel has been J-Walk books and website, then your blog! Always glad to see your posts.  &#8211; an Architect, Tacoma</p>
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		<title>By: XL-Dennis</title>
		<link>http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/archives/2005/12/07/excel-and-business/#comment-17657</link>
		<dc:creator>XL-Dennis</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 08 Dec 2005 15:01:00 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.dailydoseofexcel.com/?p=1294#comment-17657</guid>
		<description>&lt;p&gt;Dick,&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I can agree with most of the opinions You state but not all of them.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;# University &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;I dislike that higher education support commercial tools like MS Office. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Preferable is to use other similar tools as OpenOffice et al, at least in my part of the world, as the public education system is financed with public resources.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;The target with tools like Excel et al in higher education is not to get well trained students in how the tools works. The target is to create relevant information for decision making and simulations of business interest, i e the focus is on decision making and not the tool itself.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;# General&lt;br&gt;
Excel has now been around for nearly 20 years and&lt;br&gt;
companies as well as individuals assume that co-workers at least has got the basic knowledge under the belt. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Right or wrong? I can only refer to what I see and I&#039;m no longer surprised over the low level.&lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;# Corporates vs individuals&lt;br&gt;
For corporates Excel is not a critical tool/platform while for individuals it still is and perhaps always will be. &lt;/p&gt;
&lt;p&gt;Kind regards,&lt;br&gt;
Dennis&lt;/p&gt;
</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Dick,</p>
<p>I can agree with most of the opinions You state but not all of them.</p>
<p># University </p>
<p>I dislike that higher education support commercial tools like MS Office. </p>
<p>Preferable is to use other similar tools as OpenOffice et al, at least in my part of the world, as the public education system is financed with public resources.</p>
<p>The target with tools like Excel et al in higher education is not to get well trained students in how the tools works. The target is to create relevant information for decision making and simulations of business interest, i e the focus is on decision making and not the tool itself.</p>
<p># General<br />
Excel has now been around for nearly 20 years and<br />
companies as well as individuals assume that co-workers at least has got the basic knowledge under the belt. </p>
<p>Right or wrong? I can only refer to what I see and I&#8217;m no longer surprised over the low level.</p>
<p># Corporates vs individuals<br />
For corporates Excel is not a critical tool/platform while for individuals it still is and perhaps always will be. </p>
<p>Kind regards,<br />
Dennis</p>
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